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Katharine Gun's case can also be very relevant for Julian Assange's defense: "Within half an hour, the case was dropped because the prosecution declined to offer evidence. I wanted to go to the making of the filmKeira Knightley, did you meet with her?and also ask you, Gavin, about Keira taking on this role. When you think, Oh, well, I wish we tried hard with the Americanwith our American colleagues. That accountability is key. We thought maybe it would be some crusty old senior guy from a rival agency. But I felt this information was explosive, it needed to get out. Given my experience I would want to hear what happened from the horses mouth, I think.. Katharine Gun (ne Harwood), 47, is married to Yasar Gn, a Turkish Kurd, with whom she has a 13-year old daughter. AMY GOODMAN: No, you thought it was routine when he walked in. Gun leaked the memo to the press in 2003, setting off a chain of events that jeopardized her freedom and safety, but also opened the door to putting the entire legality of the Iraq invasion on trial. ED VULLIAMY: Mr. Alton, screechy, ultra-right-wing. Sometimes you break stories, and networks ring you and say they want to interview you, and then they drop you because of the agenda. I had, you know, encounters with Blair. There is no single answer to that, she says, but Bright had the best stab at it: The only thing you can do is do your job right, and be a good citizen., In other words, she says, whatever your job is, do the things that you are supposed to do. I mean, MI6 couldnt do that. I think. We speak with a British whistleblower whose attempts to expose lies about the Iraq invasion was called "the most important and courageous leak" in history by. Bright has also been closely involved with the film. AMY GOODMAN: And these ambassadors are the ambassadors of? How did she go about rebuilding her life? AMY GOODMAN: That was 2014. In 2003, she leaked top-secret information to The Observer, concerning a request by the United States for compromising intelligence on diplomats from member states of the 2003 Security Council.The diplomats were due to vote on a second United . Youre the guy who got the goods on the author of the memo in the NSA, who wrote to GCHQ and said, Were going to bug the U.N. ambassadors.. They may have chosen to push those boundaries, but they did know the difference, and they knew that it mattered if they were caught. Gun had, of course, been forced to abandon her career in the civil service and finally, struggling for work, left Britain altogether. Although Katharine Gun returned to the public eye in 2019 for the promotional press events for Official Secrets, she has largely retreated from the medias gaze since. Iraq war whistleblower Katharine Gun: 'Truth always matters' You're KATHARINE GUN: . That was in this moment, moment by moment, as the story evolves, what would it feel like if you were in her shoes. Rob Schenck, introduces newly named Senior Fellow Dr. Joel Looper and his new book, Bonhoeffer's America: A Land without Reformation. Who is Katharine Gun's Husband? Where is Katharine Gun Now? AMY GOODMAN: They said you could have pled. They knew the difference between truth, lies and propaganda. In a way, President Trump has been a gift for the previous president, George W. Bush, because it has really rehabilitated his reputation. "[12] In May 2019 The Guardian stated the case was dropped "when the prosecution realised that evidence would emerge that even British government lawyers believed the invasion was unlawful. Don't worry, we won't share or sell your information. KATHARINE GUN: Yeah, I was very excited to meet Keira in London before they started shooting. KATHARINE GUN: And also, Im justwell, whether its natural inclination or whether its what was kind of drummed into us at GCHQ, but it was, you know, this the sense of being private and not trusting journalists or people who are trying to ferret out information from you. And they attempt to deport your husband, who is a? And at some point, with great respect to Lord Goldsmith, he caves. I mean, thats why MartinI remember Martin and Ed. And its sothe nonpermanent members, who realized they were being hacked and their personal things were beingin order to try and blackmail them into a vote. And they had already taken him down into the custody suite, which is, by the way, where I had been before. "[5], Gun's regular job at GCHQ in Cheltenham was to translate Mandarin Chinese into English. At first they dont name you, but then they do. Iraq war whistleblower Katharine Gun: Truth always matters. Yes, in 2003, Gun was working for British intelligencethat's . AMY GOODMAN: I mean, youre the guy who broke the story that showed that Britain was collaborating with the U.S. in trying to get dirt on U.S. ambassadors, AMY GOODMAN: to get them to vote for the war in Iraq, which ended up killingwhat do you say at the end of the film? Copy may not be in its final form. The day before the trial, Gun's defence team had asked the government for any records of legal advice about the lawfulness of the war that it had received during the run-up to the war. I think our problem now, and I think this applies on both sides of the Atlantic, is that we have populist politicians for whom that doesnt matter. Its incredibly daunting, you know. Please do your part today. If the war was illegal and she broke the law in order to expose an illegal war and potentially save hundreds of thousands of lives, I can use this defense of necessitythats usually used in more mundane, dare I say, contextsin this great political trial., And so he says, All right, now I need to know whether the war was legal or illegal. And he says, I need to find out what Lord Goldsmiths, the attorney-generals, legal position was in the run-up to that war. Its all so resonant. It was in character, I think. Whistleblower Katharine Gun and journalist Martin Bright are interviewed for their new movie Official Secrets for the film's LFF screening. It was in a police cell that she uttered those two sentences that now seem to define the person she was and is. AMY GOODMAN: Katharine, has your 11-year-old daughter seen the film? I havent watched the films about either of them, she says. BBC NEWS | UK | Politics | Interview: Whistleblower Katharine Gun ED VULLIAMY: Yes. Yeah, so it was panic stations after that. There have been other attempts to make a film over the years. She urged "those in a position to do so to disclose information which relates to this planned aggression; legal advice, meetings between the White House and other intelligence agencies, assessments of Iran's threat level (or better yet, evidence that assessments have been altered), troop deployments and army notifications. . And you said in places like Chile. [10] Her case became a cause clbre among activists, and many people stepped forward to urge the government to drop the case. Whistleblower Katherine Gun, right, is played by Keira Knightly in the movie Official Secrets. You dont do you? When Katharine Gun came across a memo while working for the British government in 2003, her whole world changed. Hes repackaged himself as sort of the European. But lets go back to the moment. (modern). The trials and tribulations of daringly telling the truth and facing its consequences must certainly not be a light burden to bear. And the potential chink in the Official Secrets Act we had found, which could have become a defence for others, the defence of necessity [of speaking up to save imminent danger to life], it wasnt tested in court.. ED VULLIAMY: Well, he was the political editor at the time, who was giving me a lot of trouble over getting my cooked intelligence story into the paper. Do you think shed meet with me? Because I think we were both a little skeptical of each other. And we worked five, six hours every day. I wish I could have written that scene. I was aware I was doing something I wasnt supposed to be doing. Was she immediately frightened of the consequences? Film-makers generally like to glamorise newspaper offices, making them All the Presidents Men hothouses of high-level argument and intrigue. The implosion continues. AMY GOODMAN: This is Democracy Now!, democracynow.org, The War and Peace Report. In 2003, Katharine Gun, a young specialist working for Britain's Government Communications Headquarters, exposed a highly confidential memo that revealed the United States' collaboration with . Guns leak was perhaps the last example of whistleblowing that involved a red telephone box and a photocopier, rather than downloads. And, of course, I was sitting in the restaurant waiting for her to come in, and I had no idea what to expect. And also, I didnt want to even risk having a criminal record. AMY GOODMAN: And your feelings at that time, Katharine? There is a sense of, Did it really happen? Is that really me?. We, as a collective group of countries, decide that we need to stop an event, a humanitarian disaster or a genocide or whatever. So, from a dramatic point of view, you have someone whos just going to their job every day, as most of us do, happens to be a spy working for GCHQ, but could have been a person working for an accounting firm or Enron or Boeing or any other organization, who sees something that is simply wrong, sees, you know, and says, GAVIN HOOD: and says, Im going to speak up.. Fox News' Kat Timpf Marries Cameron Friscia: See the Photos - People AMY GOODMAN: Were going to leave it there, and I want to thank you all so much for being with us, Katharine Gun, the whistleblower; Observer journalists at the time, Martin Bright and Ed Vulliamy; and Gavin Hood, who is the director of Official Secrets, the story of Katharine Gun revealing the lies that led to the Iraq War on both sides of the ocean, in Britain and the United States, and led to so many deaths. "[15], In September 2019 Ken Macdonald, the former director of public prosecutions, said the case against Gun was not dropped in order to stop the Attorney General's advice on the legality of the Iraq War from being revealed. I thought you said youre sick. And I said, I need to talk to you. And so we went into a small room, and I just said, I did it. And then she put her arm around me and went, Oh, Katharine. And then I burst out crying. And he says, I need toso, Im interviewing Ben in a pizza shop, right? [5] While at work at GCHQ on 31 January 2003, Gun read an email from Frank Koza, the chief of staff at the "regional targets" division of the American signals intelligence agency, the National Security Agency.[7]. 'Official Secrets' sheds light on the story of U.K. whistleblower So, of course, it was justyou know, he was kind of thinkinghe knew I worked for the intelligence services, but he didnt know what that was. It opens on August 30th. AMY GOODMAN: Who is played in the film by? is katharine gun still married to yasar - agcoz.com To see Part 1 of our discussion, go to democracynow.org. If we found other information, it may have been different, but this information seemed to show us that wed been lied to. KATHARINE GUN: It was GCHQ internal security, yeah. And I went back to Martin. Gun has spoken at the 51Fest and conferences arranged by organizations such as the Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity (VIPS). . So I was . You work for the British government, her interrogator said, with a sneer. With no life insurance and unpaid maternity leave on the horizon, Mary Katharine forged ahead with a singular conviction. Theyre watching, you know, video games and bombs landing on Baghdadshock and awe. Why did you choose to do this film? Ben Emmerson decides the way to defend Katharine Gun is to ask for Lord Goldsmiths documents. In the very typical British manner, we just pretended we had never met, she recalled. He left the Observer not long after the events it describes and now runs the Creative Society, a charity that helps widen access to jobs in the media and the arts to candidates with non-traditional backgrounds. We didnt talk about politics much. AMY GOODMAN: So, before the time of the trial, Katharine, youthey have clamped down on you. Katharine Gun: Ten years on what happened to the woman who revealed But deep inside me, I didnt feel guilty. That whole period undermined the judicial process, it undermined the parliamentary process, and it undermined the media and press and the intelligence service. We are all of us living, she believes, with the consequences of that. But this is not the issue. Plead out. Presumably the events mark a before and after in her life. I was the U.S. correspondent indeed, but very soon I was in Najaf, Nasiriyah, Fallujah, unembedded, watching this bloody carnage, thisthe implosion of this country. [4], After spending her childhood in Taiwan, where she attended Morrison Academy until the age of 16, Katharine returned to Britain to study for her A-levels at Moira House School, a girls' boarding school in Eastbourne. AMY GOODMAN: So then you have Scotland Yard taking over. Katharine Gun (ne Harwood), 47, is married to Yasar Gn, a Turkish Kurd, with whom she has a 13-year old daughter. [19] KATHARINE GUN: So, on Wednesday morning, I called in sick. And they said they would try their best. AMY GOODMAN: Shes then arrested. And whats so marvelous about what Gavins done is to just sort of bring this back into the present. He would have had to have the authority of Lord Goldsmith to prosecute. I think the number isand forgive me, I should have the figurethree-and-a-half thousand British and American soldiers, 37,000 wounded. And we had to sit and wait for two hours while they winged it down from London. We knew for sure. These were the six "swing nations" on the UN Security Council that could determine whether the UN approved the invasion of Iraq. I think a lot of our current issues go back to that time. And all of a sudden his safe, you know, this civil servant wife is in a whole lot of bother that he never expected to have to deal with. Initially, Gun decided to teach Mandarin Chinese in Britain. Ralph Fiennes plays Ben Emmerson. But this gets out, and suddenly you see it on the front page of The Observer when you go to buy, what, milk in the morning for you and your husband. ED VULLIAMY: But my point is not against Mr. Ahmed. I was called up on Tuesday. I would love to know. Shes confessed to breaching the Official Secrets Act. KATHARINE GUN: My MP, yes, at the time. There are 15 members of that council, and there are these nonpermanent members who could swing the vote in favor of an invasion of Iraq in U.N. resolution. I mean, no ones going tono crocodile tears over that. In the movie, her husband (Adam Bakri) is initially portrayed as a civilian, perceiving her job to be mundane. I ended up, bizarrely, teaching a couple of my former colleagues at GCHQ. I met her in August in Durham, when she was on a brief visit to see her father. The diplomats were due to vote on a second United Nations resolution on the prospective 2003 invasion of Iraq. At the time, as I well remember, the paper was split in response to the talk of war. And Mr.. 15 Years Later: How U.K. Whistleblower Katharine Gun Risked Everything Keira Knightley: Iraq was the first time Id been politically engaged, Leaking or briefing? But jokes aside, the reason she said to methe reason I constantly find myself going. [5] Less than a week after the Observer story, on Wednesday 5 March, Gun confessed to her line manager at GCHQ that she had leaked the email, and was arrested. So, no, I mean, I didnt want to say I was guilty when I didnt feel guilty. AMY GOODMAN: But what caused you to say no? I dont have to be in makeup or wardrobe for hours. And she just said what she loved about Katharine isand I hope this isnt said the wrong way, and I keep saying itshes one of us. ", "US plan to bug Security Council: the text", "Let's free the Official Secrets Act from its cold war freeze | Alex Bailin", "Leaking or briefing? What I did is a very unusual thing to do, because the results are not generally good. Now, the defense of necessity is usually used in very more simple circumstances. Domination, Sing Your Song: Remembering Harry Belafonte, Who Used His Stardom to Help. It was like watching a case that was very similar to my own. You have the U.S. in the longest war in U.S. history, in Afghanistan. 'Official Secrets': The True Story Behind the Keira - Newsweek Does she think that was a unique belief among colleagues at GCHQ? I wish wed pushed it harder with the boss class within The Observer. You know, in the end, there was a feeling, I think, whatI know that Katharine and I have talked about this a lot. The classified email Gun got leaked to The Observer was evidence of the clandestine attempt of the American intelligence to reportedly seek help from the UK in wiretapping the members of the UN Security Council to motivate them to vote in favor of the invasion of Iraq. AMY GOODMAN: Works for the attorney general. MARTIN BRIGHT: I did, yes. The film stars Ma. what is the true story behind the Keira Knightley film? - The Sun I was teaching Mandarin in the local college in Cheltenham. Protesters against the invasion of Iraq, February 2003. KATHARINE GUN: Yeah. In April 2020, Gun was set to appear as a speaker at the 14th edition of the International Journalism Festival, but the event was canceled in February of the same year due to COVID-19. But my closest friends stuck by me.. And so, I immediately went home, and Iand at the time, actually, well, my dad was staying with me, because it was Chinese New Year, and he was back from Taiwan, and he was supporting me, so he was at home. I mean, couldnt have been happier with the casting choice, because Ben Emmerson is a force of nature, absolute force of nature, and a great international lawyer. KATHARINE GUN: Oh, yes, absolutely.
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